
School for School Counselors Podcast
Ready to cut through the noise and get to the heart of what it really means to be a school counselor today? Welcome to The School for School Counselors Podcast! Let’s be honest: this job is rewarding, but it’s also one of the toughest, most misunderstood roles out there. That’s why I'm here, offering real talk and evidence-based insights about the everyday highs and lows of the work we love.
Think of this podcast as your go-to conversation with a trusted friend who just gets it. I'm here to deliver honest insights, share some laughs, and get real about the challenges that come with being a school counselor.
Feeling overwhelmed? Frustrated? Eager to make a significant impact? I'm here to provide practical advice, smart strategies, and plenty of support.
Each week, we’ll tackle topics ranging from building a strong counseling program to effectively using data—and we won’t shy away from addressing the tough issues. If you’re ready to stop chasing impossible standards and want to connect with others who truly understand the complexities of your role, you’re in the right place.
So find a quiet spot, get comfortable, and get ready to feel more confident and supported than you’ve ever felt before.
For more resources and to stay connected, visit schoolforschoolcounselors.com.
School for School Counselors Podcast
Do Social Stories Really Work?
⭐️ Join the School for School Counselors Mastermind today to become the school counselor you were meant to be. ⭐️
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You’ve been asked to read a Social Story to a student—again.
And if you're being honest… you’re not sure it’s actually doing anything.
In this episode, we’re taking a closer look at the research behind Social Stories:
- Where they came from and what they were actually designed to do
- What the peer-reviewed literature says about their effectiveness (and what it doesn’t)
- How they can support emotional regulation... if you use them the right way
- The time frame for change (hint: it’s slower than you think)
- What to say when someone insists you “just need a social story”
Plus, you’ll get practical guidance on when and how to use Social Stories, and a free downloadable cheat sheet to help you back up your decisions with confidence.
If you’ve ever wondered, “Is it me… or is it the tool?”—this episode is for you.
Bonus: Grab the printable Social Stories resource pdf here
00:00 The Social Story Dilemma
01:49 Origins and Purpose of Social Stories
03:08 Research Findings on Social Stories
09:02 Emotional Regulation and Social Stories
11:44 Practical Advice for School Counselors
21:20 Conclusion and Resources
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Our goal at School for School Counselors is to help school counselors stay on fire, make huge impacts for students, and catalyze change for our roles through grassroots advocacy and collaboration. Listen to get to know more about us and our mission, feel empowered and inspired, and set yourself up for success in the wonderful world of school counseling.
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You know that moment when a teacher stops by your office and they say I have a kid that cannot follow directions. Do you have a social story you could read to them? And your first instinct probably is to open up a Google Doc or head to some sort of website and start searching for a social story that looks cute and gets close to what the situation at hand might be. I know that you do that because we have all been there. But today I want to ask a little bit bigger question what is a social story really supposed to be and, more importantly, do they even work? In this episode we are going to talk real world about social stories. They've been sold to us as the holy grail of behavior intervention, and so we're going to talk about where did the idea of social stories come from, how are they supposed to work and what does the peer-reviewed literature say about them. And then, after we get done with all that, we're going to talk about whether or not you should be using them as a school counselor. Welcome back to the School for School Counselors podcast. I'm Steph Johnson, a full-time school counselor just like you, so excited to welcome you back for another episode of the podcast. I strive each and every week to bring you the best in school counseling information to inspire your growth and help you feel more capable, more confident and more competent in your work. So let's get back to social stories. What is a social story really?
Speaker 1:The idea of social stories came around in the early 90s. A woman named Carol Gray decided that it would be a good idea to present these stories to promote social understanding. Now, make a point of that, because it wasn't to control or to influence behavior, it was to build social understanding and originally these stories were designed for students with pervasive developmental delays or with autism. These stories are supposed to describe specific situations from the student's point of view and theoretically they have a prescribed ratio of certain kinds of sentences. They have descriptive. They have descriptive perspective and directive sentences in a controlled ratio. They were originally designed to help decode social cues for kids that had difficulty understanding those and were never meant to be lectures or consequences. Social stories were developed to prepare and to reassure.
Speaker 1:So what does the research say about social stories? Because if you work anywhere, like where I work, people come up with this grand idea pretty often that hey, we just we need to get them a social story that should take care of it. Have you been in that situation? I bet you know what I'm talking about. What does the research say? Now let me tell you.
Speaker 1:I got interested in this because, again, I keep getting asked to present these social stories, and I would do so with fidelity, and I really would never see the needle move. Much as a matter of fact, I've often had my social stories crumpled up and thrown at me. If I'm being real, that's usually how those end up and so I started thinking is it me or is it the tool? And so I wanted to dive in and learn more. The tool, and so I wanted to dive in and learn more. Then this past week, as I was enjoying spring break at home, scrolling social media, seeing what was going on in the school counseling world, I ran across a post talking about a school counselor who had been mandated to provide social stories to a student. And I thought you know, with all of the talk this month on the podcast about behavior intervention and as often as we are asked to provide these social stories, they're worth looking into Because, like it or not, we are being asked more and more throughout our country to provide longer-term counseling or IEP-mandated counseling, which comes through special education.
Speaker 1:Is that an ideal situation? No, it is not. However, we also know that we need our paychecks and we are paid to follow directions. So you will never see me give this aspirational information, this perfect world scenario, and, just because you are not supposed to be doing longer-term counseling, just completely ignoring that aspect of your job. I think that's where we've gone wrong in school counseling. Instead, I want to be real and honest with you about some of the things that you're being asked to do, and this longer term counseling, iep mandated counseling and social stories, just to name a few, are going to be things that are going to be part of your world. If not now, I can almost guarantee you're going to see it in the future, and I always want to be informed. I always want to know if what I'm doing has an evidence base behind it. Is the research base sound? As a matter of fact, we just released a new relational aggression school counselor playbook in our mastermind this weekend, and as you flip to the end of it, you see an entire page of references that were used in creating that playbook, because I believe very deeply in evidence-based work. So let's jump into it.
Speaker 1:Let's find out if social stories really make the cut. Let's start with Kokina and Kern 2010. They did a meta-analysis of 18 studies regarding social stories. Half of the studies showed results and half of them did not. They found the best outcomes were for verbal elementary age students, particularly when the story was read by the student. Now pause there for just a minute and think. Most often we're either asked to read these to or with the student, or we just sort of assume that it's our job to do that to facilitate the process. Right, but this study said hold that thought, maybe it's better if the students read them themselves. Then it introduces a problem because we have a lot of kids in our schools whose reading levels are either very, very low or they can't read independently at all. So keep this in mind as we're going through this research. So so far we have a 50-50 chance of this working, but only if the student is able to read it themselves.
Speaker 1:Moving on, reynout and Carter 2006, found that adherence to Carol Gray's sentence structures remember that ratio of those three different kinds of sentences she said were essential in good social stories yeah, that didn't always improve effectiveness. They also noted that there were very few studies that tracked the long-term effects or generalization of skills coming from social stories. Wayman and Team, 2022 showed that preschoolers who were presented with social stories had improved prosocial behavior, but challenging behavior reductions were not significant and overall they noted that the quality of research with that age group was very, very low. And Hagopian and Lowry 2020, showed that social stories with visuals were effective for students at risk for emotional or behavioral disorders. So we're really seeing some mixed effects here. But the biggest thing that I have taken away from this research so far is that there is no resounding evidence that these social stories are the home run that they've been made out to be. So I tell you what let's dig a little bit deeper into the research to get a little bit fuller story.
Speaker 1:What does the research say about social stories and emotional regulation? Nine times out of ten, when the school counselor is called to present a social story, it is either meant to be a procedural story or something meant to enhance emotional regulation. So how do these stories fit in with the emotional regulation piece? Evidence is telling us is that if social stories are used for their original intent of preparation and reassurance, they can help a little. So preparation would be things like preparing for an assembly there is a fire drill coming up those kinds of things where students become dysregulated because of a certain happening. If we can prepare them, social stories can be effective in those situations. Sometimes they're effective in helping reassure students throughout a process. What happens when you go visit the speech therapist? What does PE class look like? When you walk into the room? What's the first day of kindergarten going to feel like those kinds of things? If they're used for preparation and reassurance, they can help a little.
Speaker 1:Social stories have not been shown to promote coping skills directly, but they can reduce anxiety by making the situations feel more predictable. So we could potentially use them to preview anxiety-inducing situations or to normalize emotional responses and perhaps, maybe even to teach some safe responses. Maybe even to teach some safe responses. Coquina and Kern 2010, again showed mixed results, but also noted that some students benefited when emotional language was used in the social story and reinforcements were provided. So think of social stories as a tool for clarity and for reassurance, not for therapeutic intent. They're not going to build an emotional toolkit for a kid, they're not going to be that magic bullet that we're hoping to someday find for school counseling, but they can perhaps help students access their skills and tools.
Speaker 1:So, with all this mixed research, all these things up in the air, what do we do as school counselors if we have, potentially, an IEP committee that comes to us and says we would like to write in social stories for a student? Or, my goodness, even your principal or a teacher walks up to your door and says I need you to give this kid a social story. They're just not understanding what it is they're supposed to be doing or they just won't stop yelling out in class or whatever it is. We need to have our go-to, evidence-based response, because one of the most important powers that we have as school counselors is the ability to rationalize our approaches through the research. If we start just spouting off opinions about how we feel about social stories, that argument is going nowhere. But if we are able to provide a concise explanation of why we feel that this social story may not be the best tool for that student, we're going to be in a much better place to be able to bargain through it and provide some alternative ideas for supports. So if we decide to use social stories and, by the way, I'm going to have a printable for you with this podcast episode that is going to give you a concise summary of all of these research points so that if you're ever in this conversation, or you know it's coming, you'll be able to have the information that you need at your fingertips. I'm not trying to push you away from using social stories and I'm not trying to push you into using them, but I do want you to be equipped with the knowledge and the expertise to make your argument. Either way you choose.
Speaker 1:If we decide that a social story might be appropriate for a student, we need to make sure we do some of the following things. First, we have to personalize the story. The evidence base shows us that if we present a generic story that doesn't really connect with the student, it doesn't connect with their culture or their identity or their specific situation. It's not going to hit home. The story must be personalized, personalized. Second, the social story needs to be used before the behavior occurs. This is tricky because we can't always predict when those behaviors are going to pop up right. So we're going to have to be intentional about identifying the antecedents of the behavior so that we know when to step in with the social story. But that also presents another problem because that means we've got to be on call to provide this story. If it is going to be us.
Speaker 1:My recommendation would be if you feel a social story would be appropriate for a student, you also need to make the point that the social story needs to be delivered in real time, which means it should not be you Not, with all of the surprises that you get in your day, all of the unplanned things that go on on your campus. There is no way that you can be on call for a teacher to say hey, in two minutes we're transitioning to this thing, can you come read this social story? It's not realistic. Third, and supporting that argument, social stories need to be read with the student. If the student cannot read them to you, read them with the student. Fourth, it must contain visuals or videos if you have any hope of the content landing with this student. And fifth, of the content landing with this student. And fifth and this is the part we miss a lot in schools it needs to be paired with modeling and reinforcement. We cannot just read a social story and expect it to change this child's entire perspective on their school career. It's not going to happen If you choose to use social stories, I suggest you do it with a very strong teacher who is able to see when that student is becoming escalated or dysregulated so that they can step in, so they can provide that social story in real time and then follow it up with modeling and reinforcement time and then follow it up with modeling and reinforcement.
Speaker 1:That's a tall order on our school campuses, especially when we're talking about resources that statistically have not been proven to be effective. But again, if we choose to use these stories, we also have to make sure that we stay away from the don'ts. Don't use social stories as a punishment. I see that a lot and I hear about that a lot on school campuses. They can't keep their hands to themselves when they hit. We need to read this social story. It will not be effective if it's used as a punishment or after the fact.
Speaker 1:Second, we cannot pull random social stories and present them without reviewing and personalizing them. Again, the evidence base tells us that is not going to work. But how often do you see that? And, be honest, how often have you yourself hopped onto something like Teachers Pay Teachers, found the social story that seems to align the best with the situation, downloaded it and you were off to the races. I will admit I've done it before I get it, but it's not best practice and we also, with these social stories, cannot expect instant change. This is going to be incremental change, where again and I feel like I'm harping on this, but I just want to drive this point home If you take away nothing else from this episode, I want you to internalize the fact that these social stories have not been shown to promote statistically significant effects and even if they do bring around positive change, it is going to be slow. So you may be thinking all right, steph.
Speaker 1:Well, what is the expected timeline of change if we're using a social story? Is the expected timeline of change if we're using a social story If it is related to a behavior that is clearly defined, something ultra specific like staying in your seat or not pushing your classmates when you're lining up that are observable, they're measurable and those stories are read daily and consistently. You have a chance of seeing some improvement within two weeks, but it has to be addressed with fidelity for at least two weeks. Kokina and Kern's study showed that social story implementation did bring around some change, but most of that change was short-term, it did not last and did not generalize to other situations. Similarly, ray and Carter in 2006 found that a lot of students who were presented with social stories responded within five to ten intervention days which takes us back to that two school week time frame and all improvements were not maintained. And these researchers also found and noted that no one really has assessed long-term maintenance of skills through social stories in the literature, and those skills are not being shown to generalize to other situations. So we're not guaranteeing lasting change, even if we do see some change through using these social stories.
Speaker 1:This is the same argument that I've had for years about teachers pay, teachers resources and I know that I may be slaying a sacred cow for you, because that may be where you're getting a lot of your lessons and materials, but I really feel like if they were that great, surely somebody somewhere would be coming up with some data to support that. So far, none of our creators are doing that. And it's the same with social stories, all right. So I feel like I'm really dogging on these, but I just wanted to present to you what the peer-reviewed literature says, not what the behaviorist down the hallway says, not what your school psych believes, not what the common ideation the hallway says not what your school psych believes, not what the common ideation on your campus might be. What does the literature actually say about social stories?
Speaker 1:Social stories are meh. They might help, they might not. If they're going to help, there are a lot of constraints. There are a lot of expectations that have to be built into that for it to be successful and even then you've only got probably a 50-50 shot at best. My opinion I will not be pushing for social stories on my campus. I think we can access a lot more effective tools in our work than reading a story that may or may not work. I just don't see the benefit. But again, I want to leave this literature in your lap so that you can make the best decision for your campus and for your students.
Speaker 1:If you want that cheat sheet of social story literature, you can check the show notes of this episode. There will be a link right there for you to go download that sheet and have it. You can keep it on your hard drive or in your file cabinet forever, so you will be prepared and not feel like you are caught in a corner the next time someone comes and suggests that you provide a social story for a student and I hope that was helpful to you. You know, everything that I do in School for School Counselors is designed to elevate not only your practice of school counseling but the way that you feel about your work. I don't ever want you feeling like you're caught, like you don't know how to address an issue. You have that little niggle in the back of your mind that says I don't feel like that's the best idea, but I really can't explain why in the moment. To me that's one of the worst feelings in the world and that's why I do what I do each and every day.
Speaker 1:This is an exciting time because we're just wrapping up the month of March, as I'm recording, and we've had some amazing things going on in our School for School Counselors Mastermind. We've held a behavior intervention masterclass which totally blew everybody's minds because we introduced a new behavior decision-making framework for next steps for behavior. So you don't feel like you're just grasping at straws trying to figure out what to do next with this kid. We also introduced a decision tree for determining whether behavior is really dysregulation or whether it's defiance, because, be honest, you've wondered that a time or two, haven't you? We've looked at our use of time data on our campuses. We've begun preparing for end of year data stories so that we can advocate effectively and confidently for our programs. We've held weekly support and consultation chats and we've just introduced a new AI bot into our mastermind that we're testing right now. Might be able to tell you a little bit more about it in the months to come, and you know how I feel about AI, so you know we're being very, very careful with this, but we also don't want to be left behind. So we're doing all of these things right now. In our mastermind.
Speaker 1:Our members have access to each and every resource I just described in an April. It's only going to get better. Where we're shifting our focus from behavior and we're looking at ADHD supports and interventions. What are some ways we can really effectively help these students who have so much trouble with impulse control or with concentration. Those are really really difficult interventions, and executive function, I think, is kind of hard to work into because, again, you feel like you're just shooting towards these moving targets. We're going to talk through all of that in our April Mastermind Masterclass, in addition to our weekly support and consultation, our data discussions, our new Saturday morning coffee chats and a bonus session I'm going to be doing about professional stamina Y'all.
Speaker 1:Nobody else in the school counseling world is providing this level of support, especially at this price point. $32 a month will get your seat in the School for School Counselors Mastermind. We have to charge to keep everything running because there's a lot of awesome stuff going on in there. But if you think this is the place for you and I promise you we can help you end the year strong, head over to the website to get more information schoolforschoolcounselorscom. Slash mastermind. All right, keep fighting the good fight. Go print out that social stories evidence-based sheet so you have it when you need it, and I will be back soon with another episode of the School for School Counselors podcast. Take care, my friend.